so on the subject of stolen property, i’ve seen various arguments on this point but it is in fact true that inheriting something from a relative, when you know full well that it was stolen, does not make it yours.
this clearly goes doubly so for powerful magical artifacts, and especially for artifacts which are strongly implied to contain part of their creator’s soul!
you can talk about consequences – maybe the artifact in question has benefits for you, maybe you’re not convinced its rightful owners would use it responsibly – but talking about the consequences doesn’t erase the fact that whatever benefits you think you’re getting are achieved through wrongful means.
which is why i, too, think Frodo should have given the One Ring back to Sauron. thief.
Hahahahaha here comes the law student nerd ready to complicate your wonderful post, op.
(Really this is just pretext for me to study for my property final in a week, so thanks yeah)
Because according to the principles of common property law, the matter of who actually owns title to the One Ring becomes really complicated really fast.
Buckle up babes for the pedantic law lecture no one asked for.
The best part of this is: trust me I guarantee Tolkien knew this much about the Common Law (English mediaevalists end up knowing ridiculous amounts about both Common Law and mediaeval Catholicism whether we want to or not), and indeed if you look at the text, this was relevant to the story.
It’s part of the reason that Sauron is as terrified of Aragorn’s potential claim on the Ring as he is of Gandalf’s or Saruman’s or Galadriel’s – if not more. Because in Middle Earth this shit matters. This is a world where a broken oath will literally bind your unhappy restless soul to the earth in spite of the dictates of the literal creator of the universe (who designated humans as Passing Beyond The World when they die). This is a world where a damn oath is responsible for Everything That’s Wrong With The First And Second Ages.
Oaths, ownership, duties, rights, things owed and owing: this shit matters.
And sure Aragorn is also direct line from Lúthien, but so is Elrond, and so are Elrohir and Elladan. So is Arwen. But what none of them have that Aragorn has? Is a rightful claim to ownership of the Ring.
So much of what Aragorn spends his time in the second and third volumes doing is Establishing Claim – establishing that everything that Isildur owned, he now owns. Why? Because it means he has power that is absolutely needed. “Isildur’s Heir” isn’t a woo-woo floofy-high-concept thing: it’s a literal matter of rights, duties and authority.
When he takes the Palantír from Gandalf and uses it, his companions are aghast, but he reminds them that he has both the right and the strength to use it – and the Right is actually important. Saruman was, face to face, stronger than Aragorn (never doubt that) and Sauron completely pwned him, but Saruman had no right to the Seeing Stone, no more right than Pippin.
But the Palantíri belonged to Aragorn: he’s not only Melian’s ever-so-great-grandchild, he’s also Fingolfin’s ever-so-great-grandchild, and since the Fëonori died out with the poor Ringmaker, the only competition Aragorn could have for ownership of the Stones are Galadriel and Elrond. (And that’s only if you are going right back to the maker-rights, and ignoring the establishment of the Stones as the property of Elros’ line rather later).
It matters. It changes how power works and doesn’t work. Aragorn’s status as the Heir is in fact grounded in these ideas, which play a hugely powerful part (in fact the fight over who rightfully owns the Silmaril Beren and Lúthien brought out of the dark is part of the bloodshed that makes it so that in the end the Silmarils themselves actively reject the last two living sons of Fëanor, negating their claim). Because Aragorn is the rightful inheritor of everything Isildur ever had, he can use the Palantír. Because he is the rightful inheritor of everything Isildur ever had, he can summon the Dead. And because he is the rightful inheritor of everything Isildur ever had, he stands equal to two of the Ainur, to the oldest member of the Trees-blessed Noldorin royal house, and to his own much more powerful (straight up) relatives as a potential claimant of the Ring.
And that is why Sauron is willing to take the chance to catch Aragorn, and (he thinks) ensure his capture, rather than attacking him earlier on when there’s a chance that (even if Aragorn can’t possibly WIN) he could still escape and then bide his time before the next Ring-War and learn to use the damn thing.
But. It’s also important when it comes to Frodo.
Frodo uses the Ring twice, and lays open claim once. Both of the times he uses it are on Sméagol, both times overwheming him and in the second case cursing him (“if you ever touch me again you will be thrown into the fire”). We get both moments from Sam’s POV, where the physical reality of Frodo is replaced by an image of him as a much larger figure, alight from the inside, robed in light, and with a “wheel of fire” at his breastbone.
Frodo does not have any genetics (so to speak) more special than any other hobbit. It’s not like Aragorn vs most humans, where there’s actually a legit difference because most humans were not, at that point, descended from a Maia. Frodo’s just this guy.
The only thing that’s really special about Frodo in terms of the Ring is that, like Aragorn, he’s the other person who has a viable claim. It would, as it were, have to go to the judges to figure out whose claim is better.
And this is why in the moment that he claims the Ring, in the Mountain, Sauron is fucking terrified. It’s why he drops everything else, even the issue of trying to keep his mindless drone-fighters going, even the maintenance of his actual control of weather, of light, of whatever fight he and Gandalf have going, to get his best servants back to the Mountain now now now now.
Because Frodo having an actual rightful claim on the Ring means he can, in fact, use it. Not well, which is why Sauron can paralyse him for that moment it takes for Sméagol to strike (and carry out both Frodo’s demanded oath – “save the Precious from Him” – and his Curse – “if you touch me you will be thrown in the fire” – at once), but he could. This tiny little person is a threat to Sauron, in the heart of his own home, because he has the right to have and use this Ring.
The tricky thing about Tolkien is that whatever his flaws (and he has many), the one thing he’s never unclear of is that the concept of right and might are actually separate. Just because you are strong enough to do or take a thing doesn’t mean you have any right to do it; and just because you aren’t strong enough to enforce your right, doesn’t mean it goes away.
Partially inspired by this post of @actualmermaid‘s. Down with swan!Elwing, long live pelican!Elwing.
Practical considerations:
Swans are not seabirds- swan!Elwing would not have done terribly well flying from Sirion to the middle of the blasted ocean whereas pelican!Elwing could use her special drag-reducing low flying technique or just swim ragefully underwater
Pelicans are very large indeed, among the heaviest of all flying birds. Even a Vala must have some trouble with the law of conservation of mass, and elf->bird poses some definite dilemmas. Go for the largest bird possible!
Why dangle your Silmaril precariously off a scrawny little bird-neck when you could make a bird with a built-in Silmaril pocket
But if you really have to have the Silmaril hanging from the bird neck for ~ambience or w/e, pelicans are still superior. Swans fly with their neck parallel to the ground, making it very easy for a necklace-mounted Silmaril to slip tragically into the ocean, whereas pelicans fly with their heads practically resting on their bird shoulder blades, like a girl whose unnecessary male dance partner at the club has just tried to kiss her. Far more stable.
Pelwing
And lastly, this image:
Judgy black-and white sword bird, neck bag glowing with all the glory of the light of Aman: Plummets sword-first to the deck
Eärendil, struggling to “take into his bosom” an enraged 25 lb bird with a hallowed combination pike/satchel bag for a face: “It’s me wife!”
And lastly lastly, if you’re into that depressing symbolism, how about the pelican who pierces her own breast to feed her young, or sometimes kills them herself and revives them with her own blood and suffering. How about that, huh.
tfw you get Elwing Discourse adjacent material in your mentions and you wonder what’s going down this time
I love how GRRM weaves these threads of hope throughout his stories, even in the darkest hours when all our heroes are teetering on the edge of the abyss. And it’s Ned who reminds us not to give up hope. Of all the characters GRRM could have chosen to express this sentiment in ADWD, he picked good old dead Ned. Ned who helped do the impossible and cast off the tyranny of the dragons, Ned the White Knight who lives on in the rallying cries of Northmen willing to fight and die for “Ned Stark’s little girl.”
Because Ned Stark is just … everything. GRRM isn’t saying Ned Stark was a fool. GRRM warns us against abandoning honor in the face of a dishonorable world. When the world grows dark, GRRM tells us, we need to hold fast to our principles as tightly as Arya clings to Needle. It will be a long, stumbling journey through night, but that’s when true knights are needed most. It will be hard … but what if we succeed?
“what if we prevail?”
It makes me think of JFK:
We choose to […] do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard, because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win
One becomes a true knight, not because it is easy, but because it is hard, because that’s what makes it worth doing. And not everyone will succeed, but what if you do? “what if we prevail?”
This feels like the point of ADWD to me, Ending slavery is hard, but Dany must try anyway, because it is right. Incorporating wildling refugees into Westeros is hard, but Jon tries anyway, because it is right. The break between Tyrion and his family is crippling, but opposing House Lannister is right. And Bran … Bran’s journey through the darkness is one of the hardest of all … but what if we prevail?
So try, GRRM says. Try, even if it’s impossible. Because what if we prevail?
I know I’m biased, but the Silmarillion fandom is one of the most shockingly amazing things ever. It’s such a culturally obscure piece of media. Like there’s no show or movie or anything, just some equally obscure metal albums and the author’s more widely known related works that overshadow it. It’s a dense book with a narrative that reads more like the Bible than a conventional novel, not to mention that it’s technically unfinished. Even many long-time Tolkien fans haven’t read the Silmarillion. Most people outside of the Tolkien fandom and the fantasy lit community don’t even know what it is. AND YET there’s somehow buttloads of fan art, fan fiction, cosplays, ships, fan theories, fandom in-jokes, music (Did I mention metal?), bootlegged unofficial tie-in novels, and more. People research every bit of trivia and lore about Tolkien’s world to learn more about these characters and their stories. I thought I was a hardcore Silmarillion nerd before I got more involved in the fandom. NO. Compared to most of these people, I’m a filthy casual. I read walls of text analyzing characters and the languages and the mythos and I just end up scratching my head wondering where these bloggers come up with this stuff. There’s so much love and energy and freaking TALENT poured into this community, even though it’s a lot smaller and less popular than other fandoms. It’s been about a decade since I first read the Silmarillion, and there wasn’t a huge amount of stuff out there related to it (God bless Jenny Dolfen), but it seems to have exploded in popularity over just the last couple of years. Heck, I think it’s getting bigger.
And this fandom is NICE, too. Most the Silm folks on Tumblr and around the web are smart, mature, usually pretty friendly people. There’s minimal stupid drama and controversy, everyone just wants to share their nerdy feels and geek out over Tolkien.
The Silmarillion has been so foundational in shaping my creative life, including my interest in the fantasy genre, writing, art, and world-building. It’s a nearly constant source of inspiration. It’s one of my all-time favorite books and is so special to me. The Silmarillion fan community is completely bonkers, bizarre, and incredible. I’m so happy I get to be part of it.
I think I figured out part of what bothers me about a lot of the set-up in in The Clone Wars: The Jedi seem to get blamed for what’s actually the fault of the Senate.
The Jedi are beholden to the Senate, they’re the governing body and the Jedi work for them. They’re not allowed to go free the slaves on Tatooine unless the Senate gives the order. And I don’t recall a single instance of a Senator arguing to go free the slaves. Padme, despite her life being saved by Shmi on Tatooine, I have never seen her argue to the Senate (who are the ones who would have that authority) to go free them.
And, for another example, the Jedi are not allowed to do anything about the clones, because the clones are beholden to the Republic/the Senate as well. The Jedi work with them, they command them, but the clones are not the Jedi’s property (ugh, that word), they’re the Senate’s. When the Senate votes to order more clones from Kamino? When the Senate votes to revoke restrictions on the banking clan so that they can borrow more money to buy more clones?
That’s not the Jedi, that’s the Senate.
And, sure, you could argue that the Jedi should just leave the Republic rather than be beholden to the Senate (which is a process that would have taken years), but then how would they have supported themselves? They had food bills, starship bills, fuel bills, clothing bills, etc. Should they now charge people when they went to help them? Should they make it a setup where only the rich could afford the Jedi’s help? Should they just not be peacekeepers at all anymore?
Let’s also say the Jedi had refused to fight–how very, very easy would it have been for Palpatine to say, look at the Jedi, unwilling to fight! They call themselves peacekeepers and yet refuse to fight for us! Why, what are they planning? They have all this power, what are they waiting for? and have people’s paranoia overtake them.
I feel like sometimes… what Palpatine did was really insidious on even more than just a canon level. Even in the narrative, sometimes it feels like the Jedi were responsible for things that they actually had no control over and that’s exactly what Palpatine wanted, to be able to discredit them and put them in an unwinnable position.
The Jedi aren’t perfect, of course they’re not. They were out of touch and they had grown stagnant and while it’s admirable in theory to be super objective (their code isn’t about denying you have feelings, but about being objective, that “no emotion” means you put yourself outside of it so you can make the most rational decisions/see things as objectively as possible) needed to evolve. But they weren’t given a whole lot of choices in the time they had and they made the best ones they could out of some bad situations and the tragedy of the PT (which is all about tragedy) is that it wasn’t enough to save them.
LET ME TELL YOU ABOUT WHY I WILL DEFEND OBI-WAN AS BEING A GOOD MASTER FOR ANAKIN SKYWALKER:
Can you IMAGINE if someone had done this to Anakin? Just tossed him aside with a quick “oh, he’s ready for the trials” because they’d found someone shinier and newer to train?
I don’t think it was that bad of Qui-Gon, I get why he felt this was the best way forward, and I think Obi-Wan got over it because he had bigger things to worry about and he does understand what Qui-Gon was thinking. It stung, but Obi-Wan’s used to that by now.
But Anakin? No, Anakin would never have understood. For all that they have terrible communication and misunderstand the depth of what the other feels, Obi-Wan and Anakin share something vitally important: They’re both prone to attachment.
Obi-Wan allows Anakin’s attachment (probably tacitly, but still an allowance) in a way that I don’t think another Jedi Master would have. And certainly Obi-Wan would never do this to Anakin, would never shove him into the trials because he had someone new that he was going to focus on, would never cut that relationship off so abruptly. And if he had, Anakin would have been devastatedby it.
Instead, Obi-Wan’s thoughts on a new apprentice, even once Anakin is a Knight and has his own apprentice now:
Obi-Wan doesn’t take on another Padawan because he’s still there for Anakin, who needs that support. Any time I start wandering down the path of, “Hmm, would Qui-Gon have been able to prevent Anakin’s fall?” I come back to this moment and think that Qui-Gon’s refusal to allow room for attachment would have driven Anakin away faster than Obi-Wan’s more allowing nature.
I have no doubt that Qui-Gon would have cared very much, but I think the mutual “flaw” of attachment in both Obi-Wan and Anakin allowed for a stronger match than they maybe always get credit for. Anakin needed that, needed even more than Obi-Wan thought he needed, and every time I wonder about Qui-Gon, I come back to that he would have been even less of that, not more.
The Valar’s capture of Melkor after the awakening of the elves is a last desperate sortie; they do not know that they will succeed, that they will not fail and fall and leave the world to utter darkness.
Melkor is strong. He has thrown them down and driven them out time and time again, left them battered and in disarray. Only his pride and carelessness and the delicate hand of Eru bringing hope from despair has left them as much as they have now. Even so, they are scarred, wounded, crippled.
The maiar who guard Cuvienen are ordered that if their Lords and Ladies fall, they must not stay and fight. They are to take as many of the Eldar as they can and run; behind the stony walls of the Pelori, within the light of the Trees, perhaps they will be able to hold against the siege that Melkor will surely bring against them for defying him so. At least something will be salvaged, at least their Father’s youngest children will not live purely under the dominion of darkness. Perhaps, with time to grow strong in safety, these new Children will be able to win free of the darkness themselves. Perhaps the One will have given them some new gift to defeat the dark one.
But somehow they succeed: Melkor is cast down, enchained, captured and defeated. They have a few more scars, and even more maiar who will never fight again. Victory unlooked-for – and the Eldar never question at what price their freedom was bought.
“its not that bad if you don’t look up” JYN THEY KILLED YOUR MOM, I’D SAY THATS PRETTY DAMN BAD
Wasn’t that part of her character arc though? I mean, she started out not giving a shit because she didn’t think it affected her and she was selfish because she closed off after all that happened to her. I think one of the main points of the film was to show that Jyn learned to realized the Empire really was affecting her and everyone else and she learned not to focus on herself so much that she was willing to be a sacrifice for everyone else in the end.
I don’t even think it was that. I think she knew very well how terrible the empire was and cared but didn’t feel like she could actually do anything about it or was welcomed by those who were fighting. This is the same person who was kicked out of Saw’s band of Rebels because of who her father was so likely felt very unwelcomed by any organized Rebellion effort in theory and then most definitely in practice when the Alliance freed her only do they could use her to get to her father.
Jyn is a character who rushed out into blaster fire to save a child with zero hesitation when Cassian is telling her not to do it. Jyn is a character who was introduced to us as adult in an Imperial prison going to be worked to death in an Imperial labor camp. She is a character who is threatened by the Alliance when they “rescue” her and told that if she doesn’t serve them they will “put her back where they found her.”
When she says that line to Saw Gerrera she is lying, and every action she takes shows that she is merely saying this to him because she feels personally betrayed by him and the Rebellion he stands for. When he starts talking to her about the cause she is upset because he booted her out of that cause and so she says something that she knows goes against what he believes. He shows her her father’s message as a sort of reconciliation.
I don’t know what movie people are watching where they think Jyn is the epitome of apathy because she is not. She is just disillusioned with the Rebellion. And she has every reason to be. The problem with her writing as I see it is that she too suddenly puts aside her reservations about the Alliance after they literally kill her father, but I forgive that by reasoning that she really was just running with the only feasible way to honor her father and make sure he didn’t die in vain and that an atrocity like Jedha City wouldn’t happen again. That and she has growing trust for Cassian (which was admittedly a rushed transition but like not a reason to crucify her character over).
I’m just about 100% done with the vilification of Jyn tbh it is boring as hell.
I’m going to start off by saying that I’m using “whitewashing” to mean “make more pure/noble” rather than “take a character who is canonically not white and make them white in the adaptation”. It’s a legitimate definition, just less popular on this site. (For those interested, Galadriel is canonically “blonde” and that’s really about it.) Anyway. Onwards.
Galadriel in the books has a very long history. She’s the daughter of Arafinwë “Finarfin” Finwion, the third son of the High King of the Noldor (a group of elves) who later becomes King of the Noldor in Valinor after his father dies. She has always been very powerful, very strong, and very independent, but what’s changed has been her motivation.
Thanks to Christopher Tolkien’s work, we’re able to see multiple versions of the story of the Silmarillion as it develops, and one of the most interesting changes that emerges is that Galadriel becomes more and more morally pure from draft to draft.
Originally (and this is really summing up), when the Noldor wanted to leave Valinor (I’d be happy to explain that if you’re interested but it would be a long explanation to put here), Galadriel went with them because she was interested in exploring Middle-Earth and establishing a realm of her own and ruling as a queen there maybe. Leaving proved complicated, though, and she wound up in the middle of an awful fight (a Kinslaying) between her father’s people (the Noldor) and her mother’s people (the Teleri). She fought for her mother’s people, and probably killed some Noldor while she was at it, and then traveled with her uncle Fingolfin’s host to get to Middle-Earth. She came under the Doom of Mandos just like everyone else and would now be exiled from Valinor. Essentially, Galadriel was in the same boat (ha ha) as the rest of that group of Noldor – she’d done some bad things and would now have to learn to live with the consequences. However, later drafts have her refusing to take part in the Kinslaying at all, instead leaving Valinor before the others and by a different route. Her motivation was now to explore and seek out other elves, with less emphasis on pride or the desire to rule. She came under the Doom not because she’d done bad things but because she left Valinor at all. Also, in earlier versions of the Silmarillion she was swayed by Fëanor’s rhetoric and convinced to go to Middle-Earth by his speech, whereas in later drafts she could tell he was a bad egg and refused to have anything to do with him.
Honestly I as a fan am really bothered by this. Not because Galadriel in later versions of the Legendarium is less of a character (hardly) but because this showcases what might be called an inability to deal with moral ambiguity in women. (I firmly believe that Tolkien’s writing is not inherently misogynistic but there’s an argument to be made that it can be inherently sexist at times. This is one of them.) Galadriel in early drafts has quite a lot of potential, and in fact she’s quite probably the most developed of any of Tolkien’s women. She goes from being proud and assured of her own status to an exile in a strange land after committing awful atrocities, and she must adapt and grow and atone for what she’s done if she’s to be truly Wise. (This is the version of Galadriel that I adopt into my own personal canon, for what it’s worth.) Robbing her of that journey might make her a more admirable paragon but it doesn’t do her any favors.
So I was thinking… If Rogue one it’s supposed to be set shortly before the original star wars that means that while Jyn Erso is kicking ass and being generally awesome, and Leia is busy leading a rebellion, Luke Skywalker is somewhere in Tatooine whining about power generators
Time to do this again I guess; Luke would be WORKING.
You know. On the farm.
And wishing (”whining”) he could spend more times with his friends (who are very questionably friends, but what are you gonna do when there’s no one else your age to hang out with and Biggs is gone) because while he knows he needs to help Owen and Beru with the farm, he has other desires, and even if hanging with his friends aren’t exactly that (like leaving Tatooine), it’s the next best thing.
I mean, aside from flying the skyhopper but I imagine it doesn’t hold quite the same charm without Biggs, as much as he loves flying and probably does it as much as he can.
But you know.
Working. Because he has to for their livelihood. But I guess making “jokes” about Luke being “whiny” is funny.
(And once again, it was never about the power generators. Owen literally says right after it “you can waste time with your friends when your chores are done”.)
Seriously.
I wish folks would take note of Luke’s dialogue with Owen at the beginning of A New Hope. He suggests that now that Owen has the two droids, he can hire a couple of farmhands and Luke can finally get off planet like he’s wanted to.
It would take Owen multiple people and two droids to replace the work that Luke does on the farm. That is pretty clear indication that Luke is working a fairly grueling, punishing schedule.
This is not a knock on Owen, because it certainly seems like Owen and Beru work as hard as Luke does. But they are poor. They live on a planet where their source of income is pulling moisture out of the sky, while raiders, slavers, and Jabba the Hutt are all within spitting distance.
And the poor kid gets perpetually knocked for the fact that he wants to take a break and hang out with his friends a bit. Or the fact that he’s disappointed he can’t get off this hellhole planet.
I haven’t been keeping up with Rogue One spoilers, so I can’t talk about Jyn, but Leia is another story.
Leia’s accomplishments are impressive, and this is not intended to dismiss that. But Leia had time and opportunity to accomplish those things. She can afford to focus on politics and intrigue because as a Princess, she doesn’t need to worry about food, water, or shelter. She has access to educational materials that Luke can’t even dream of. She knows influential people and can make social connections. The only powerful social connection Luke could possibly make is a creepy Hutt with a dancer fetish.
It’s a funny juxtaposition that the ladies are out accomplishing more things, earlier, than Luke is, but we shouldn’t diminish the role poverty plays in Luke’s lack of opportunity, since that kind of thing exists in real life too.
THIS. All of this.
And, on the flip side: Luke is the single solitary hero in any generation of Star Wars canon whom we ever see doing teenager-appropriate things as a teenager.
Padmé, Anakin, Ahsoka, Kanan, Leia, Ezra, Finn, Rey… Only a couple of them even had normal early childhoods. Every single one of them was shouldering adult responsibilities and/or being shaped for a purpose they didn’t choose as an adolescent.
Owen and Beru may not have had much to give Luke, but they made damn sure to spare him that. That is something to celebrate. Why the hell do people insist on mocking him for it??
radiantanor.home.blog 